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Five Ways You Can Help Pakistan (and the Rest of Us) http://bit.ly/dk3DV5 #Truthout #p2 #p2b Davis Case Reignites Death Penalty Debate http://bit.ly/8YfrfL #Truthout #p2 #p2b
Via @Politicususa: The Tea Party’s Success May be Sarah Palin’s Demise http://bit.ly/bW21Es | #p2 #p2b
Speaking in Yellow: The Crisis in Our Politics http://huff.to/cx3jsp via @huffingtonpost #Media #p2 #p2b // Must read article. Via @ThinkProgress: Poll: 71 Percent Of Americans Still Blame Bush For The Current Economic Woes http://bit.ly/aRZWbz | #p2 #du1 #dnj #p2b Via @ThinkProgress: Dick Armey Advances Bizarre Voter Fraud Theory: 3 Percent Of Democratic Vo... http://bit.ly/ahsfi3 | #p2 #du1 #dnj #p2b Via @ThinkProgress: Ryan Knocks GOP Tax Cut Fantasy: ‘I’m Not One Of These People Who Says Th... http://bit.ly/b4D1te | #p2 #du1 #dnj #p2b
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With all this bitching about left and right politics has anyone of you considered the fact that there really isn’t any difference between the two political parties below the surface. Does anything really change? In the past decade we have seen a huge expansion in the government and never ending wars. Both parties are completely responsible for all of it. During Bush’s second run in office the democrats had the control of the house as well as the senate. Did they stop Bush from doing whatever he wanted? No they just rolled over and let him do whatever he wanted. This is appalling considering most of the democrats who ran during that time all talked about bringing the troops home and ending the war. What happened? Not a god dam thing. Just on and on about time tables that never went anywhere. Obama was the same way. He ran his campaign with talking points about ending the conflict over in the middle east and bringing the troops home. But what was the absolute first thing that Obama did when he entered office (this was his first weekend in office) he sent a bunch of troops to Afghanistan. Talk about being a hypocrite. Bush and Obama both passed huge wasteful and mischievous bailouts, does this not ring any bells?
If you want to keep fighting about health-care and teabaggers or whatever ludicrous garble that keeps you mad at each other, than go for it. But all of you need to take your heads out of your asses and realize most, but not all, of our politicians are shills or puppets getting fat and rich off our misery.
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It is nice to see that some people can respond to posts with sensibility when the original rant is full of hatred, inaccurate information, and uses profanity. How can “UncaJoe” expect logical people to just go along with this message of hate (his last paragraph dooms the entire article) when he does not even take the time out to cite sources to add some validity to his claim? It’s disheartening when people do not even try to look at things rationally and just poke fun at people they do not agree with.
I wanted to take a moment to inform you about two of the untrue facts stated within this post (luckily, I’m not going through the whole post, just the items that struck me right away). Sorry for the length everyone. I doubt many of you will read it, but I can always hope that there are people out there who want the facts. I normally go for a more creditable source then Wikipedia, but seeing that this is not a paper for a college class, I have research these topics before, and I have already wasted enough time reading every comment, it is good enough for today.
“You didn’t get mad when the Supreme Court stopped a legal recount and appointed a President.”
-This statement sounds familiar and accurate, if you ignore the details. The Supreme court did stop the recount… the third recount. They made a good decision that a candidate for president cannot just ask for unlimited recounts, or we probably would have been recounting votes into 2000. The complete count declared Bush as the winner. The first recount was mandatory by Florida State law because of how close the race was (Bush won). This count was done by machine. The overseas votes were not accounted for in the original numbers. They were not processed until after the first recount (Bush still winning). The second recount was by hand at Gore’s request that Bush was declared winner by 537 votes. Gore requested another recount, this one by hand. The Florida State Court refused to recount all the votes by hand, which was overturned by Florida Supreme Court before the US Supreme Court stepped in and ruled that the recount could not be done in time for the December 12 deadline. If Gore would have asked for all of the over 70,000 rejected ballots to be recounted the first time, I’m sure they would have tried, extending the deadline as reasonably as possible, but the fact that he wanted recounts of just 4 targeted counties and not the entire state says a lot. Information from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_2000#Florida_recount
“You didn’t get mad when we illegally invaded a country that posed no threat to us.”
-Many people have been mad and protesting this war, some of which are tea party members. I could go on about this one for a long time, but I am just going to cite the legality of the war; “the US Congress passed the Authorization for Use of Military Force Against Iraq Resolution of 2002.” The UN never brought any official charges again the US for going into Iraq. Information from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legality_of_the_Iraq_War
Okay, one more without a cite. “You didn’t get mad when we let a major US city drown.”
Seriously, how much money did people donate to help New Orleans? It does not make sense to protest a natural disaster. Mad is not the proper term here, unless you are strictly referring to how long it took for FEMA to respond, the people who decided not to leave, and the people who left the disabled behind, otherwise the feeling you should have is sorrow for the people who lost their homes and lives.
This post just proves the bitter ignorance many people have. The tea party movement is not one side. It is not left or right. It is American people who have come to the realization that our country is heading in the wrong direction. It is for the fundamental right of the American people to live by the Constitution. Some of the things mentioned in the main post did make many of these people mad, but it was not enough to unify them together. It takes time for people to realize that their rights are being violated and even longer for them to realize that they can do something about it. As with all groups, there are unfavorable people within the crowd who make matters worse instead of better. Most tea party members are civil. They do not want trouble, only to let the government know that they are unhappy with the way their rights are being trampled and the Constitution ignored. The guidelines that most use for tea party protest are those of Martin Luther King. They do not promote violence. It is always the extremists, not the majority, who get the attention and give the whole movement a bad name.
Americans are the most generous people in the world, the issue is, that many, like the tea party members, want to preserve the right to make the decision of where their generosity goes. Everyone does have the right to get treatment when ill. A hospital is not allowed to refuse an individual seeking medical attention. There are many free clinics out there, some government supported, some set up and maintained by wealthy individuals that you would rather vilify. One person can make a bigger, positive difference in the lives of many people when left to their own devises than the government can as they try to disperse the wealth of the nation.
American is supposed to be the land of opportunity where you are allowed to keep that which you have worked hard for. Welfare has destroy what it means to be an America as we have generation after generation growing up believing that they are entitled to everything instead of having to work for it. It was a good idea at one time, but the system has been warped, no longer being a temporary state. Universal health care will become another program that holds Americans down. When they have to tax you over half your paycheck to pay for it, you might start to understand and appreciate what the tea party movement is doing. As more information about the health care bill comes out, the more people are realizing that it is going to cause a lot more problems than it is going to solve. Companies are looking at the provisions and realizing that under the new system it will be financially better for them to drop health coverage all together and pay the fine for not offering it. This experiment has already been tried and it is failing. There is a reason why people from countries with socialized health care come to American for certain treatments. Health care is not going to get better with the involvement of the government. Look at the condition of social security and Medicare.
I pray that common sense will one day reach you and not because the tea party movement failed and we are experience the downfall of America. They say to live in ignorance is bliss, but it’s also very dangerous now that the misinformed can share their thoughts with the whole world. Thank goodness there is a chance for rebuttal. Hopefully most people who see UncaJoe’s post will recognize it for what it is, just a bitter, hate filled rant from someone who does not have all the facts straight.
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UncaJoe Reply:
May 25th, 2010 at 9:10 pm
Regarding 2000 Elections: Please explain how Al Gore received -16,022 votes Volusia County, Florida before you choose to say the election was not a fraud.
If the only major Tea Party candidate to date is Rand Paul how can you even consider your party as “not left or right”. The only social programs Mr Paul likes pad his own pockets! He a typical teabaggin’ hypocrite. Phrases like “Don’t steal from Medicare to socialize healthcare” show your party’s excepted hypocrisy and ignorance. Playing on the ignorance and irrational fears of the uneducated and elderly show no respect for either group. Your “party” is pure hatred of change.
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tailback Reply:
June 30th, 2010 at 7:38 am
Are you serious Kelly. You talkabout the “fundamental right to live by the constitution”. First of all, you guys tend to forget about a document called the Preamble to the U.S. Constitution. Go read it and find some excuse that it really means something other than what it say’s.
At a White House meeting while Bush was president GOP leaders and White House staffers told Bush that his hardcore push to renew the more onerous provisions of the Patriot Act would further alienate conservatives who were already angry for many reasons. “I dont give a goddamn,” Bush retorted, “Im the president and you’ll do it my way.” “Mr. President,” one aid in the meeting said. “There is a valid case that provisions in this law undermine the Constitution.”
“Stop throwing the Constitution in my face,” Bush screamed back. “Its just a goddamned piece of paper.”
Three people in the meeting that day all gave this account of what happened and what was said. Bush treated our “Constitutional rights” like they didnt exist, and where was the Tea Party to protest any of it ? They were nowhere to be found. What rights has Obama trampled on of yours? I hear the accusations all the time, but never any details because its not true. Where was the Tea Party to protest Bush racking up a $10 trillion dollar federal defecit ? The Tea Party’s silence during the Bush years speaks louder than all the B.S. they claim now.
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Deborah Reply:
August 11th, 2010 at 3:07 am
@tailback,
Could you cite your information please?
Many thanks
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we need healthcare people are dieing every day bacause they don’t have any health insurance. The teabaggers are wrong!
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This straight-forward list packs a wallop, in my opinion. It seems like that Tea-party advocates aren’t really mad about “government” and they aren’t really mad about government incompetence.
As a dedicated progressive/liberal/social Democrat, let me I believe EVERYONE SHOULD BE AGAINST THE PUNISHING MANDATE TO BUY PRIVATE CRAPSURANCE!
All this does is give big insurance trillions of dollars that they will use to lobby (buy) our representatives for years, until they destroy what weak reforms are in the bill.
Call your Rep and ask to repeal the mandate ; )
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Oh… and there’s this…
Maybe the following verses aren’t in a tea baggers Bible:
“Do not take advantage of a widow or an orphan.” Exodus 22:22
“Do not oppress the widow or the fatherless, the alien or the poor. In your hearts do not think evil of each other.” Zechariah 7:10
”There will always be poor in the land. Therefore I command you to be openhanded toward your brothers and toward the poor and needy in your land.” Deuteronomy 15:11
“But when you give a banquet, invite the poor, the crippled, the lame, the blind.” Luke 14:13
“Anyone who oppresses the poor is insulting God who made them. To help the poor is to honor God.” Prov. 14:31
“He who shuts his ears to the cries of the poor will be ignored in his own time of need.” Prov. 21:13
“If you give to the poor, your needs will be supplied! But a curse upon those who close their eyes to poverty.” Prov. 28:27
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I love the fact that only one person truly addressed the issue in the blog. Why does the “teabaggers… er… teaparty party (say that fast a few times)” hate health care reform. That was the point of the blog – right? They didn’t get mad for eight years over all the other stuff, but they do get mad when health care might be offered to 35 million other Americans.
Ok… the one woman answered the blog… she doesn’t want it because 35 millions Americans refuse to work. That’s what she said… go check, I’ll wait. (whistle whistle… hummmmmmm). See? She said, and I quote, “I tell you what makes me mad, is people who get upset over alot of us not wanting to give away what we have worked for to those who are unwilling to work… Notice I said UNWILLING, NOT UNABLE…. BIG DIFFERENCE.”
Which (bad grammar and all) if taken literally (which I see no other way of taking things from people like her) means 35 million people are unwilling to work. That includes ALL the Americans on unemployment during this economy laid off and whom cannot afford COBRA, all part time employees who are not offered insurance by their employers, all self-employed workers who cannot afford the outrageous premiums charged by insurance companies, all employees of small businesses which do not offer medical insurance plans, oh and all those college students who cannot be covered by their family’s plans because they are too old… and the largest group of all… the spouses and children of all these “unwilling to work” Americans.
One thing I have noticed about teabaggers… oops… teaparty members… is that in all the video of them on Faux News, CNN, ABC, CBS, NBC, etc is that they are all white, middle age or older, and very very angry at one man… a half-black man. So they didn’t get mad until a black man passes health care that will cover all Americans. You notice even on this blog those neo-cons/tea-swillers who wrote said Katrina didn’t bother them? (pre-dominantly black city and victims), torture didn’t bother them (brown people of the Muslim faith – and evidence overwhelmingly showed that we received NEGLIGIBLE information from all that torture and NONE that saved even one American life). Admit it… you like it. You like that all these brown and black people suffered – because they scare the ever living CRAP out of you. And you sure as hell don’t want one of them in YOUR White House!
Face it teabagg… (dang, I just can’t help myself)teapartiers, you want to be preceived one way… but with the media coverage, and your lunatic fringe out there spitting on black congressmen, threatening violence against democrats, and poor spelling on racist sounding signs, the perception is… you guys are haters who didn’t get mad until a half-black man earned the most powerful job on the planet. THAT’S a fact. (Oh… by the way… which half is black and which is white?)
“Obama is not a brown-skinned anti-war socialist who gives away free healthcare. You’re thinking of Jesus.” – John Fugelsang
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WorkingClassMale Reply:
July 12th, 2010 at 11:43 am
Odinson — you are so right! These Tea-Baggers claim to represent the “grass-roots” of America. They do not! They just represent a bunch of ignorant dupes of the Republican Party who want to continue to destroy our country and erode our rights in the name of All-Mighty Profit. Tea-Party — why don’t you all help the deficit by dying! It would save so much Medicare and Social Security! You don’t like living off the government anyway, do you?
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Teabaggers. So stupid, so transparent.
Thanks for putting this up, and fuck the concern trolls whining about bad words.
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I love the number of self-defenders here saying “B-b-but I did get mad at that stuff – I did hate that stuff…”
Yeah, right. You voted for all of it.
Twice.
And you never once threw bricks through windows. You didn’t get up in arms at townhall meetings until 2009, did you? You didn’t show up at rallies while packing rifles.
But you were secretly mad while laughing along with the morons on Fox News at all the libuuuls protesting the Iraq war.
Sure.
And now you’re mad that you’ve been pigeonholed along with the more violent among you?
Sorry. Every time you ask me to answer for something Sheryl Crow said, you should understand we will ask you to answer for the people with guns & bricks. That’s how it works. Get used to it.
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oh and john by the way if you have insurance and get cancer you have a very good chance of being dropped by your insurance while medicare has to treat you get it right. do a google search on children dropped from insurance and you will see what the insurance companies think of you and your children.
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oh so the fact that the deficit started in bush’s first year isnt a problem
the fact that every democrat pres in the last 30 years has run in the positive numbers
the fact that it was bush that destroyed our economy look at those numbers the bank crash was his and his alone
the fact that the housing crash was because of bush policys it didnt build itself then crash in 12 months
the fact that bush spent more on war in his 8 years than the usa has spent on war in its entire history
wake up if your movement is about helping people why do you want those same people who helped pollute your rivers and air turn your moutains into valleys and stole your tax money. back to where they were how will that help your children. all bush and his bushies did was increase your deficits every year he was in office. and just so you know his tax cuts for the rich cost us 3 times what the tax costs for the working class would. if you lose $1000 a year it hurts but if they lose 1million of their 1billion they would need a calculator just to realize it was gone! comeon bush helped outsorce your jobs and lower your tax credits and lied saying oh it helps buisness to give them a tax free life all while we pay the bill.
wake up and smell the dung cuse we got shat on and trust me thats not purfume we smell.
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RM4812 Reply:
May 22nd, 2010 at 10:43 pm
You said “…that every democrat pres in the last 30 years has run in the positive numbers.”
Dude, put down the crack pipe. You are have no clue as to what you are talking about. Every President for the past 30 years has faced a deficit.
You ruined the rest of your post with the idiocy of the second line.
Go back and learn some more history, and this time try not to just suck up what Chomsky and Zinn are spoon feeding you. Both are losers, and have many blatant lies in their rendition of history.
i.e. Noam speaks out loudly against wealth and greed, but he donate any of the millions he has made on book sales and speaking engagements? The answer is no. Does the word hypocrite apply? Maybe.
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Look, the truth of the matter is that the tea party movement started with honest well meaning Americans. It was hijacked by Faux News and other neocon interests. Nevertheless, many of the people there were progressive libertarians and other groups that are fed up with reckless government spending and killing in our name. It is time for us as a people to rise above the false left-right paradigm that many of us still seem to be stuck in. The fact that you are outraged is a start, but I assure you that your anger is misguided. We need to start seeing politicians as the crooks and cronies for special interests that they really are. It matters little what party they belong to when neither side ever serves the interests of the people. It is time for a new party in this country, one that can't be boxed in and rebranded as a fringe part of an already existing party. I am with you on almost all of your points but I am also with the tea partiers (not “baggers” which was simply another attempt by the mass media to make the events look “fringe”) on many of their points. If you want to keep being a sucker and getting sucked into the left-right paradigm then bay all means continue, ignorance can be bliss. “Change” hasn't happened at all, look no further than our failed empire building foreign policy and the fact that the dollar is on the verge of hyperinflation and collapse.
If you want real change like bringing our troops home, more transparency, and most importantly a politician that lives up to his promises (I invite you to check out his track record and consistency in voting against funding for the war) come join us, the revolution grows every day.
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I did get mad when the Patriot Act got passed.
I did get mad when we illegally invaded a country that posed no threat to us.
I did get mad when I found out we were torturing people.
While much of the rest is annoying, it is par for the course regardless of which party is in power. I only tend to get mad when the government makes some fresh in roads on freedom. Then what happens is the other party gets elected and does little or nothing about what made me mad. Instead they choose to make some new inroad. <sigh> Such is life in America.
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You made 14 assumptions about millions of individuals that you know nothing about. Is this the progressive superiority in education, open mindedness, tolerance and all those other lies you like to yourself?
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Nice language by the way. What respect can you really expect?
Well, by the way, No you didn't get it 'straight' and your way off base.
It is very naive to think a country so far away cannot impact us here in the US, but your not going to be convinced. Look what happened on 9/11 from so far away. But that was the Bush administration, right? You DID mind that tragic day didn't you WALLDUDE?
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This person is as CLUELESS as to WHO the tea party protesters are as the pathetic Republicrat opportunists trying to pander to them are.
This would be as asinine as pigeon holing all WTO/G20 protesters as violent Anarchists just because some Anarchists show up at those protests.
Personally, I was (and continue to be) as outraged by the huge expansion of near dictatorial power of Government and Corporations under the Bush Administration as I am by the continuation of it under the Obama Administration…. Read more
When so called 'progressives' (and so called 'conservatives') get hip tot he fact that the only 'two' sides in our Republic are Big Government/Corporations vs. We The Individual People then we may get somewhere.
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Epic.Win.
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Posting in an epic troll thread.
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Hee hee hee…you taught me something I didn't know before. I didn't know they had mothers. Wondered why they dressed so funny!
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I think that all political parties are corrupt. They have their own preservation as their only goal. It is time that we as a nation wake up to the fact that we'll never continue as a great nation as long as we continue to leave GOD out of our country. If we continue down this road we will follow the Romans and Greeks and all great civilizations to self destruction. We have history to guide us but we fail make correction, but make the same mistakes and follow the way of the DODO!!!!. It is time to wake up America and follow our fore fathers to continue to make America the greatest place to live.
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I would like to add, my family was republican, I was too, until I realized Liberals wanted to help others, and I thought that was such a great idea, then I realized the philosophy behind liberalism and the fact that it doesn't work, and I also noticed that so many liberals were only such when it served their own cause, so I became a republican again, then I realized almost all politicians (I will leave this open for those VERY few in both parties) are liars, cheats, thieves, and not worthy of the jobs they hold, so I am now an American first, Libertarian/Independent.
I am looking for a party that stands for America, and what it stands for, I have the read the Declaration of Independence, The Constitution, The Federalist Papers, and Common Sense (both versions) and this country has strayed from the great nation it was. Life, Liberty, and the PURSUIT of happiness. NOWHERE does it say, if I am pursuing my happiness I am to stop, and make sure you are happy or worse, pay to make you happy, (unless that is what I want to do)
Tea Parties aren't about which party is right or wrong, it’s what about what is right for this country, we need to all step back, look at what is going on, stop the name calling, quit the bitching, and fix this. The problem IS the government, until we get them out, we can't fix this, NO country in the world has ever survived Gov Healthcare without taxing the hell out of everyone. I realize there are those of you that aren't paying taxes now, and think, what a great idea to get all this coverage for free, it won't be, it never is with the Government.
There is a great Article at The Atlantic online http://www.theatlantic.com/doc/200909/health-care/ it explains a lot of the failures of even our existing system, those that may occur from letting the government in, and possible fixes, read it with an open mind, there may be a way out, but not the way we are going..
And this is only a start, we need to get the government out of our lives PERIOD, when the government controls our lives, what is the difference between that and slavery? This country is founded on freedom, don't relinquish it so easy, once you lose it, you have to fight to get it back – remember that scene in Braveheart? “Aye, fight and you may die. Run, and you'll live… at least a while. And dying in your beds, many years from now, would you be willin' to trade ALL the days, from this day to that, for one chance, just one chance, to come back here and tell our enemies that they may take our lives, but they'll never take… OUR FREEDOM!
Every time you give a live bit of control away, you give away your freedom, until all of a sudden its gone..
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Actually, I think a better analogy is:
A liberal is a person that doesn't pay taxes, but is upset when others don't want to spend their tax money on him.
A conservative is a person that thinks that if you work for a living, you should keep as much as possible to do what they want to do with it.
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JRY:
First of all, the “gay Republican facists (sic – I think you meant fascists)” had nothing to do with Katrina. As an American, I believe the government inept when it comes to dealing with things like Katrina: “Cash For Clunkers” is the most recent example of that. However, the examples of failures by the government is endless: social security, FNMA/FHLMC (more govt. than private), medicare, medicaid, etc.
However, after reading your post, I was disgusted with you. For you to use the terms “gay ass Republicans”, fascists, etc. doesn't invite conversation: it invites a reciprocal response. My first reaction was to call you names as well. However, what's the point? What do I accomplish by doing so? What do you accomplish by calling people the aforementioned names?
If you are mad at the system, become part of the solution. Right now, you appear to be part of the problem. Your post does not invite dialog, and it certainly doesn't suggest that you wish to engage in a “problem solving dialog”. It really just appears that you are angry, and want to vent. You obviously have passion, and you used energy to vent: what did you accomplish?
Come on, let's all do better. Let's be civil, and solve the problem. I have no faith that this government (or any ones prior to this one), based on too much history, will solve the problems we face as a country. Screw them: let's, as Americans, roll up our sleeves and get it done.
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Hey John, from another John, natural disasters happen, but your gay Republican facists who believe so much in business being so superior to government hired businesses to take care of people, move them around, and find them housing after Katrina.
They botched it! They screwed it up! The place is still a mess!!! Why? Because the houses and neighborhoods that were destroyed belonged to the poor so businesses didn't give a godamn rats ass to help them.
And your economic BS about prices rising? Wait a minute, all you gay ass Republicans didn't whine or bitch when everyday prices throughout the Bush admin rose by about 60-70% yet you're somehow guessing the prices will rise under Obama? You're such a hypocrit its not even funny, how moronically stupid you people are!!
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Nope……I don't care if America tortures the people who have information of events that could save lives of innocent people. You also were calling people stupid……ok how about a person that blames his country for a NATURAL DISASTER. What the fuck…. does the gov. now control the weather? And the deficit?? Obama's first year's budget is more than every president's in history ALMOST COMBINED. You want to talk about this new Universal Healthcare?? First off I don't have health insurance. If it were to pass you can expect EVERYTHING that you buy to damn near triple in cost. It won't be seen on the price tag because that would be too obvious, but it will be made through an extreme increase in taxes. Because, nothing is free and that is how they are attempting to sell the idea. Not only that…….they will have control and say so on how much a doctor is ALLOWED to make, and on down the line of jobs in healthcare. Which in effect will cause the quality of care to plummit, because why would a person that went through 12 years or so of med. school do anything more than he has to if he isn't going to get paid for it. Also, how would you like it when your over the age of 60 (because you WILL get there) and the wonderful government won't treat you if you're diagnosed with cancer or deminsia? Even if you could have afforded your own health insurance.
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Anonymous Reader Reply:
April 6th, 2010 at 12:44 pm
Katrina was a hurricane. Big deal.
What flooded New Orleans wasn’t Katrina.
What flooded New Orleans was a man-made disaster caused by questionable engineering and decidedly bad maintenance and supervision and oversight.
New Orleans was destroyed by Republican policies.
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Fuck you. A large number of us “teabaggers” are just as pissed as you are about all of the stuff that you listed. We feel that the last president was just as detrimental as the current one, if not more so. We're pissed as hell about the Patriot Act, the War in Iraq and the money we've spent on it, the infringement of our privacy via wiretapping, the illegal torturing, the debt. etc.
And we're pissed that a dying Republican Party is trying to hang its hat on our reputation to save itself. Most of the original participants in tea parties going back quite a while were independents, libertarians, and those who had defected from the batshit insane Republican Party. With this one issue we happen to agree with the Republican Party, and I'm honestly glad for the support because perhaps we'll actually succeed in keeping the government from grabbing another inch of control it isn't supposed to have and doesn't deserve. But I wonder if it's worth it if everything else we stand for gets ignored and we're linked with the Republicans.
I stand for limited to no government control… in people's personal lives, in the affairs of other sovereign countries, and with the money I earn. We disagree on this issue, but clearly we agree on plenty of others. So do us a favor… argue with us based on the facts relevant to this issue rather than trying to pin a bunch of bullshit we don't even stand for on us. It's called a straw man. I don't need to defend all of the other positions because I don't stand for them.
But if you'd like to make a legitimate argument for socialized healthcare, perhaps we can have a civil discussion about it.
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Skeptical at best Reply:
April 2nd, 2010 at 4:39 am
You’re kidding, right?
If this quote is true: “A large number of us “teabaggers” are just as pissed as you are about all of the stuff that you listed. We feel that the last president was just as detrimental as the current one, if not more so. We’re pissed as hell about the Patriot Act, the War in Iraq and the money we’ve spent on it, the infringement of our privacy via wiretapping, the illegal torturing, the debt. etc.”, then where the hell were your big protests then?? Where was your outrage then? Seriously.
I love how you all say you are against the things that Bu$hCo did, but I sure didn’t hear any of you. I didn’t hear any of you protesting the theft of our rights, our money, our reputation, our blood. Where the hell were you then? Funny how we’re only now hearing about how “pissed” you all supposedly were. Liar.
And any of you out there willing to give up your constitutional and civil liberties for the illusion of “safety” are spitting in the face of every single person who has ever died or fought defending this nation. The so-called “Patriot Act” is despicable as are many of the laws that came thereafter. To quote Ben Franklin, “Those who would give up liberty for safety deserve neither.” (paraphrase)
Legitimate argument for NATIONAL healthcare:
1) Saves money for the nation and individuals
2) Saves lives
3) Improves quality of life
This is NOT to say that I support the huge giveaway to the insurance and pharmaceutical industries that just happened. I am adamantly against that bill. It is garbage and solves nothing.
And the standard Republican talking point of “those who are UNWILLING” to help themselves is just so much crap. How many out there are unemployed through NO FAULT OF THEIR OWN right now? Hmmmm??? How many are underemployed? How many simply can’t afford healthcare even when working if it isn’t offered by their employer? I couldn’t and I make a reasonable living. Specious argument at best and quite telling of your “me first, me only” mindset. No wonder society has barely progressed past the caveman.
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You are right, I didn't get mad when my nephew went overseas and got shot to preserve YOUR right to be a complete idiot who cannot carry on a conversation without cursing. I didn't get mad at the Patriot Act because even with all of its flaws it is designed to protect us. I tell you what makes me mad, is people who get upset over alot of us not wanting to give away what we have worked for to those who are unwilling to work… Notice I said UNWILLING, NOT UNABLE…. BIG DIFFERENCE.
As far as Katrina, where is the anger over the people who didn't leave when told the storm was coming. I wasn't aware that there were caves in New Orleans that the people live in and didn't hear the warnings!!! What about the LOCAL government doing their part and getting the people who were UNABLE to leave on their own got out safely? Again see the difference here between UNABLE and UNWILLING….
I have no problem helping someone who has tried all that they can to help themselves, I have a HUGE problem with the government taking MY MONEY to help those UNWILLING to help themselves…
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Skeptical at best Reply:
April 2nd, 2010 at 4:44 am
Candidate for Congress Rebecca Schneider says it best right here as to why we should not allow laws like the Patriot Act to go unchallenged:
First they took away my privacy,
But I didn’t care because I had nothing to hide.
Then they took away free speech,
But I didn’t care because I never spoke out.
When they took away habeas corpus,
I didn’t care because I wasn’t a criminal.
Then they took away the right to assemble,
But I didn’t care because I didn’t demonstrate.
Finally, they took away my freedom…
And no one cared because
they were all silenced or jailed.
Visit her website and offer support for a candidate that makes sense!
http://www.rebeccain2010.com
If you like Alan Grayson, you’ll love Rebecca!
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As much as I agree with you, you didn't have to come down to the Teabaggers' and Birthers' levels with the F bombs. Our cause is right, we desperately need major healthcare reform, so don't act like them when you talk about it.
Let them destroy themselves with their lies about death panels. Let them foam at the mouth when we talk about spending a fraction of the money they're spending on an illegal war to help our own people. Let them try to use thuggery to accomplish what they couldn't do in the ballot box last year.
If we act like adults we will give Americans a clear choice and will insure the Republicans stay out of office for decades to come. Let them act like the nuts and the crazies. They are already doing a great job of positioning themselves as the fringe party.
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Its sad isn't it.
A liberal is a person who gets mad when there tax money is spent on killing people.
A conservative is a person who get gets mad when their tax money is used to save people.
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You are just plain wrong here, and you are playing the same BS divisive politics that you are accusing “teabaggers” of.
I am a liberty-oriented republican, and I was and am aboslutely opposed to Obama. I think government health care is a disastrous idea.
Yet, every single item on your list is distrubing for me as well. I got very mad when we found out about the downing street memo, about torture and rendition around the world, and when our government contributed to the problem of Hurricane Katrina.
Please don't box us in like this. It's OK for us to be angry about all the things you listed and still be opposed to government health care.
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Rational Person Reply:
April 1st, 2010 at 4:41 pm
Here it is almost Easter and I bet you claim to be a Christian. Tell me please what do you sheepal in the republican party see so grossly unjust about health care for those that need it? Why do you feel the health care industry should not be regulated? DO NOT tell me you are against deficit spending because your party has been responsible for the largest deficits in the history of this nation. WAKE UP!
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I really liked you post! But everything starting with “fuck” totally knocks the wind out of it. Consider ending your post after the ellipsis “…”
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Americans did protest almost every event you listed above; because anger and resentment builds over time (like when you dad beats you every night), eventually you get mad enough to take serious action. That's what you're seeing with the tea bagers
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Boy am I glad we live in a “civilized” country where we treat people with respect.
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I also get mad when people like you and your administration stoops to middle school level humor to talk about any opposition.
Grow up.
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And I was also very pissed about the Patriot Act. But there was already something like it in use. If you go on your phone and say a few key words:
(communisiam, attack, bomb, assasinate, president, kill, White house, and various other fun words)
You set off a machine somewhere >.>
I don't remember where exactly, my teacher 2 years ago told us about it. It apparently was left over from the Red Scare.
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I did get frustrated when we invaded Iraq cause we didn't have any Business there.
I would have been made if I had known 10 bill had gone missing, and I am now.
No I didn't get mad when I found out people were getting tortured. Why should I? Helps protect our troops and us.
I am VERY pissed we haven't caught Osama, or at least found out he is already dead.
Why would I be mad about New Orleans? It was a Natural disaster, crap happens. The nation was in shock.
Yeah I was mad when we hit a trill. I was mad when we hit 500 bill. But I'm more mad about 12 FCKING TRILLION!!!!
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tailback Reply:
June 30th, 2010 at 6:39 am
hey dumb ass, over $10 trillion was racked up during the Bush years. Funny though, the rich got a lot richer under Bush, the poor got a lot poorer, and the middle class are mostly poor. Bush was the worst domestic terrorist this country has ever seen.
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